Discussion:
Meridian Water
Add Reply
Basil Jet
2018-03-26 04:39:35 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
The latest Modern Railways has a track diagram of the track from Lea
Bridge to Meridian Water (the replacement for Angel Road station) which
is currently under construction. It's a single track with no junctions
from south of Coppermill Junction to the single platform at Median Water
station. They are talking about 2tph off-peak and 3tph peak. The current
journey times between Lea Bridge and Angel Road are in the vicinity of 9
to 11 minutes one way. Admittedly the new station will be slightly south
of the current one, and the start of the branch will presumably be about
600m north of Lea Bridge station, but that still doesn't leave a lot of
leeway (no pun intended) for a 3tph service.
Basil Jet
2018-03-26 13:04:45 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Basil Jet
The latest Modern Railways has a track diagram of the track from Lea
Bridge to Meridian Water (the replacement for Angel Road station) which
is currently under construction. It's a single track with no junctions
from south of Coppermill Junction to the single platform at Median Water
station. They are talking about 2tph off-peak and 3tph peak. The current
journey times between Lea Bridge and Angel Road are in the vicinity of 9
to 11 minutes one way. Admittedly the new station will be slightly south
of the current one, and the start of the branch will presumably be about
600m north of Lea Bridge station, but that still doesn't leave a lot of
leeway (no pun intended) for a 3tph service.
Forgot to ask, will it be signalled as a single block?
Jim Chisholm
2018-03-27 17:05:46 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Basil Jet
Post by Basil Jet
The latest Modern Railways has a track diagram of the track from Lea
Bridge to Meridian Water (the replacement for Angel Road station)
which is currently under construction. It's a single track with no
junctions from south of Coppermill Junction to the single platform at
Median Water station. They are talking about 2tph off-peak and 3tph
peak. The current journey times between Lea Bridge and Angel Road are
in the vicinity of 9 to 11 minutes one way. Admittedly the new station
will be slightly south of the current one, and the start of the branch
will presumably be about 600m north of Lea Bridge station, but that
still doesn't leave a lot of leeway (no pun intended) for a 3tph service.
Forgot to ask, will it be signalled as a single block?
Have watched the work on a number of occassions, from the obvious
"Japanese Knotweed" work that seems like years ago.
Good that passive provision (and better) for 4-tracks is happening. Pity
they haven't done that for some on recent FBs on stretch towards Roydon.
The diagram in MR suggests 'One Engine in Steam' on the third track.
Paul Corfield
2018-03-28 10:18:50 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Basil Jet
The latest Modern Railways has a track diagram of the track from Lea
Bridge to Meridian Water (the replacement for Angel Road station) which
is currently under construction. It's a single track with no junctions
from south of Coppermill Junction to the single platform at Median Water
station. They are talking about 2tph off-peak and 3tph peak. The current
journey times between Lea Bridge and Angel Road are in the vicinity of 9
to 11 minutes one way. Admittedly the new station will be slightly south
of the current one, and the start of the branch will presumably be about
600m north of Lea Bridge station, but that still doesn't leave a lot of
leeway (no pun intended) for a 3tph service.
Haven't seen that MR but it matches what is appearing on the ground. I don't see how there can be 3 tph on the single extra track. The driver would have to be an Olympic sprinter to get out of the north end train cab and be in south end one in less than a minute when turning round at Meridian Water.

The plan was always that 2 tph would be provided on the third track and 2 tph would stop on the main line to give 4 tph overall. The DfT specced that as an add-on to the Gtr Anglia franchise spec but with a proviso that a pure clockface headway from Meridian Water / Stratford could be flexed in the peak given capacity constraints on the main line. If there is now a suggestion that the best that can be achieved is 3 tph overall then that's deeply disappointing. I use the service from T Hale to Stratford quite a lot but the half hourly frequency is a bit of a pain. Can't wait for 4 tph which will be vastly more convenient. The numbers using the service are pretty decent - must have been 50 people waiting at T Hale for an mid afternoon service last week. Vastly more at Stratford for a PM peak departure.
--
Paul C
via Google
Basil Jet
2018-03-28 13:37:38 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Paul Corfield
Post by Basil Jet
The latest Modern Railways has a track diagram of the track from Lea
Bridge to Meridian Water (the replacement for Angel Road station) which
is currently under construction. It's a single track with no junctions
from south of Coppermill Junction to the single platform at Median Water
station. They are talking about 2tph off-peak and 3tph peak. The current
journey times between Lea Bridge and Angel Road are in the vicinity of 9
to 11 minutes one way. Admittedly the new station will be slightly south
of the current one, and the start of the branch will presumably be about
600m north of Lea Bridge station, but that still doesn't leave a lot of
leeway (no pun intended) for a 3tph service.
Haven't seen that MR but it matches what is appearing on the ground. I don't see how there can be 3 tph on the single extra track. The driver would have to be an Olympic sprinter to get out of the north end train cab and be in south end one in less than a minute when turning round at Meridian Water.
The plan was always that 2 tph would be provided on the third track and 2 tph would stop on the main line to give 4 tph overall. The DfT specced that as an add-on to the Gtr Anglia franchise spec but with a proviso that a pure clockface headway from Meridian Water / Stratford could be flexed in the peak given capacity constraints on the main line. If there is now a suggestion that the best that can be achieved is 3 tph overall then that's deeply disappointing. I use the service from T Hale to Stratford quite a lot but the half hourly frequency is a bit of a pain. Can't wait for 4 tph which will be vastly more convenient. The numbers using the service are pretty decent - must have been 50 people waiting at T Hale for an mid afternoon service last week. Vastly more at Stratford for a PM peak departure.
Thanks, Paul. I've just reread the paragraph of the article twice. It
explicitly states that the shuttle will have 3tph peak and says nothing
about mainline services at all, although mainline platforms do appear on
the diagram. Have you noticed if mainline platforms are appearing on the
ground at Meridian Water?

Maybe MR has got it a little wrong, and the branch will have 2tph all
day and the mainline will have 1tph peak and nowt off-peak. But if they
want the 3tph to be evenly spaced, that would still mean the branch
would have to have alternate headways of 20 and 40 minutes in the peak.
3tph on the branch and 1tph on the mainline would push the branch up to
15 and 30 minute headways, which would be even tighter (impossible?).

It seems more likely that they will have 2tph on the branch all day, and
2tph in the peak direction only on the mainline, and MR has somehow
misinterpreted the one-way 2tph peak service as a two-way 1tph service.
But that means MR has made two separate errors in the one sentence.
Paul Corfield
2018-04-03 12:57:23 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Basil Jet
Thanks, Paul. I've just reread the paragraph of the article twice. It
explicitly states that the shuttle will have 3tph peak and says nothing
about mainline services at all, although mainline platforms do appear on
the diagram. Have you noticed if mainline platforms are appearing on the
ground at Meridian Water?
Maybe MR has got it a little wrong, and the branch will have 2tph all
day and the mainline will have 1tph peak and nowt off-peak. But if they
want the 3tph to be evenly spaced, that would still mean the branch
would have to have alternate headways of 20 and 40 minutes in the peak.
3tph on the branch and 1tph on the mainline would push the branch up to
15 and 30 minute headways, which would be even tighter (impossible?).
It seems more likely that they will have 2tph on the branch all day, and
2tph in the peak direction only on the mainline, and MR has somehow
misinterpreted the one-way 2tph peak service as a two-way 1tph service.
But that means MR has made two separate errors in the one sentence.
I haven't been up to Meridian Water recently but I did look at the plans online a while back. Both Northumberland Park and Meridian Water will have two platforms for the main line plus one for the shuttle. Space and other provisions are made in the design of both stations to add a fourth platform and the associated bridge / ramp / step links.

Meridian Water will consist of an overbridge structure with steps/lift up from street level with access to the platforms from the overbridge. The overbridge also links both sides of the redevelopment.

https://www.networkrail.co.uk/running-the-railway/our-routes/anglia/lee-valley-rail-programme/

Network Rail's online info refers only to 2 extra tph from the shuttle. I am beginning to think that the DfT have watered down the obligations on Greater Anglia to stop 2 tph throughout the day on the mainline tracks at Meridian Water and Northumberland Park. Clearly the tracks are congested and there are pathing issues but it will be a shoddy service if there is not a decent clockface, frequent service at these stations. The whole point is to provide a decent local frequency. 2 tph is not decent in built up parts of London. All this nonsense just because a bloody airport has to have 4 tph serving it.
--
Paul C
via London
r***@cix.compulink.co.uk
2018-04-03 13:08:07 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Paul Corfield
Network Rail's online info refers only to 2 extra tph from the
shuttle. I am beginning to think that the DfT have watered down the
obligations on Greater Anglia to stop 2 tph throughout the day on the
mainline tracks at Meridian Water and Northumberland Park. Clearly
the tracks are congested and there are pathing issues but it will be
a shoddy service if there is not a decent clockface, frequent service
at these stations. The whole point is to provide a decent local
frequency. 2 tph is not decent in built up parts of London. All this
nonsense just because a bloody airport has to have 4 tph serving it.
And why shouldn't Stansted Airport have 4 trains an hour serving it? Compare
frequencies to Heathrow, Gatwick, Luton.
--
Colin Rosenstiel
tim...
2018-03-28 10:47:41 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Basil Jet
The latest Modern Railways has a track diagram of the track from Lea
Bridge to Meridian Water
why have they given it such a daft name?

Yes I know it's named after the new housing estate, but they aren't floating
houses, are they?

tim
Charles Ellson
2018-03-28 23:45:10 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by tim...
Post by Basil Jet
The latest Modern Railways has a track diagram of the track from Lea
Bridge to Meridian Water
why have they given it such a daft name?
Yes I know it's named after the new housing estate, but they aren't floating
houses, are they?
The A1055 Meridian Way has been around for some years.
tim...
2018-03-29 07:54:50 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Charles Ellson
Post by tim...
Post by Basil Jet
The latest Modern Railways has a track diagram of the track from Lea
Bridge to Meridian Water
why have they given it such a daft name?
Yes I know it's named after the new housing estate, but they aren't floating
houses, are they?
The A1055 Meridian Way has been around for some years.
by why "Water" instead of Fields or Village or ...

tim
Basil Jet
2018-03-29 08:15:10 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by tim...
Post by Charles Ellson
Post by tim...
Post by Basil Jet
The latest Modern Railways has a track diagram of the track from Lea
Bridge to Meridian Water
why have they given it such a daft name?
Yes I know it's named after the new housing estate, but they aren't floating
houses, are they?
The A1055 Meridian Way has been around for some years.
by why "Water" instead of Fields or Village or ...
Because it's surrounded by the various distributaries of the Lea?
Alan Grayer
2018-03-29 15:12:02 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by tim...
Post by Charles Ellson
Post by tim...
Post by Basil Jet
The latest Modern Railways has a track diagram of the track from Lea
Bridge to Meridian Water
why have they given it such a daft name?
Yes I know it's named after the new housing estate, but they aren't floating
houses, are they?
The A1055 Meridian Way has been around for some years.
by why "Water" instead of Fields or Village or ...
tim
Well, it is apparently being built on the River Lea flood plain...

Alan
Graeme Wall
2018-03-29 15:40:25 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Alan Grayer
Post by tim...
Post by Charles Ellson
Post by tim...
Post by Basil Jet
The latest Modern Railways has a track diagram of the track from Lea
Bridge to Meridian Water
why have they given it such a daft name?
Yes I know it's named after the new housing estate, but they aren't floating
houses, are they?
The A1055 Meridian Way has been around for some years.
by why "Water" instead of Fields or Village or ...
tim
Well, it is apparently being built on the River Lea flood plain...
New route for the boat train?
--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.
Basil Jet
2018-03-29 15:48:53 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Alan Grayer
Post by tim...
Post by Charles Ellson
Post by tim...
Post by Basil Jet
The latest Modern Railways has a track diagram of the track from Lea
Bridge to Meridian Water
why have they given it such a daft name?
Yes I know it's named after the new housing estate, but they aren't floating
houses, are they?
The A1055 Meridian Way has been around for some years.
by why "Water" instead of Fields or Village or ...
tim
Well, it is apparently being built on the River Lea flood plain...
So long as there are just garages on the ground floor, that's not a
problem. Broadwater Farm is designed that way in the River Moselle flood
plain.
Offramp
2018-03-29 16:43:52 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Basil Jet
So long as there are just garages on the ground floor, that's not a
problem. Broadwater Farm is designed that way in the River Moselle flood
plain.
Is that to help irrigation on the farm? What do they grow there? I imagine it is something like corn, if it needs that much water.
Basil Jet
2018-03-29 17:32:53 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Offramp
Post by Basil Jet
So long as there are just garages on the ground floor, that's not a
problem. Broadwater Farm is designed that way in the River Moselle flood
plain.
Is that to help irrigation on the farm? What do they grow there?
Rape, mostly.
Offramp
2018-03-29 15:43:25 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by tim...
by why "Water" instead of Fields or Village or ...
Yeah It sounds like a company.
Loading...